New Projector Picks

[Vic]

Hello everybody.
Question for all.

New projectors have popped out of the woodwork in the end of 2011.

Debate on what projector are on the radar for everybody. Pros and Cons.

Here's a list that I see are the possibilities:

3D capable

JVC DLA-X3
JVC DLA-X7
JVC DLA-X9
Optima HD33
Optima HD8300
Optima HD3300
Panasonic PT AE 7000
Sony VPL-HW30ES
Epson 3010
Epson 6010
Mitsubishi HC9000D

2D

Panasonic PT AE4000
Optima HD20
Epson 8350
Mitsubishi HC4000


Anything else you want to add to the list, please do and give your explanation as to why.

[Vic]

WHOA!
Nobody rush here too quickly to put their 2 cents here!

[Suave]

Hey Vic - it looks we all somehow missed this first post so thanks for nudging us. Thanks for putting together this comprehensive list of the new models above

I've owned the Epson PowerLite Home Cinema 1080 UB projector for about 3 years now and I've been very happy with its performance. Epson's 3LCD technology produces a truly excellent, natural picture. However projector performance, just like TV performance, has been advancing rapidly and hence got me thinking about upgrading my projector. Since projectors aren't cheap and it's not an item that you would upgrade too often, I would definitely like to go with a 3D model.

So based on my experience with the Epson I would definitely consider the PowerLite Pro Cinema 6010 which retails for about $3999 US (and comes with 2 pairs of 3D glasses).

I've also always been a fan of the JVC projectors, its D-ILA technology produces one of the top pictures available today. I recently watched the JVC DLA-X7 in action (showing Avatar in 3D) and its picture looked killer - the colours, black level, contrast and 3D performance were all flawless. Since the DLA-X7 is a little out of my price range ($7999), I am leaning toward the DLA-X3 ($4499 US).

So that's my two cents! Are you looking to buy a projector yourself Vic? Any brand/model that you're leaning towards?

[Mike Osadciw]

Happy Halloween, everyone! Some comments on the projectors below. I always relate them to screen size and gain because these things **MUST** be considered when considering a projector. These are two piece systems and must be customized correctly or expect to be underwhelmed or disappointed in the image quality after the "wow" effect of a big screen image dies off. Remember that lamps in these units only put out so much light, and from the first day run they slowly get dimmer. At about 1000 hours, you are at approximately half the light output (aka brightness) as the day you first set it up. Sufficient light output is 100% necessary for a pleasing picture!! It's wrong projector/screen size that people get wrong almost all of the time. Let me save some aggrevation by posting my screen size recommendations. Want to go bigger and still have accurate - then a step up to brighter projectors will be necessary.

3D capable

JVC DLA-X3 - limited colour control - wrong colours - corrected with external colour management video processor. All else is good. Screen recommendations up to 120" diagonal for 18fL of reference white with new lamp, 1.3 gain screen.

JVC DLA-X7
JVC DLA-X9 - both are same as above, but each of these have highly effective colour management controls. No need for external colour management controls. Great black levels.

Optima HD33
Optima HD8300
Optima HD3300 - I do not have experience with these models...not yet. If they function like past models, good bright pictures on screens up to 110" diagonal. Black levels aren't quite as deep as the JVCs. Reference white could be a bit higher on these than the JVC, but I would need to test to be sure.

Panasonic PT AE 7000
Sony VPL-HW30ES - both of these could be hit or miss. They are good budget projectors. The Sony will most likely need an external colour management processor as it does not have an 18-point colour management control built in. What that means, like the base JVC model, is that it does not display HDTV colour at the correct intent - these projectors are too colourful. The Panasonic will look best on a screen size 92" or smaller. Anything bigger and it gets dim quite fast (if it's like all other PT-AEx000 projectors). This Sony also probably won't make very bright images either. I'm cautious about recommending Panasonic (see the PT-AE4000 note below).

Epson 3010
Epson 6010 - I'm always quite happy with Epson projectors, no matter what price point. The 8350 model is best on a screen no bigger than 92" diagonal. These models here will probably be ok up to 100", but anything beyond that expect to get lower than 20fL of light on a 1.3 screen.


Mitsubishi HC9000D - I have no experience on this piece and have not read much about it.

2D

Panasonic PT AE4000 - good if you can pick it up cheap. Beware of "dust blobs" (green patches of light seen on a completely blackened screen. Plagued all Panasonic projector models up to this point. Some had it, some didn't, eventually some more got it. For this reason, I never felt comfortable recommending Panasonics over the years despite their very good image quality after calibration. Again, nothing more than a 92" screen if a good picture is desired.

Optima HD20 - no experience

Epson 8350 - simply awesome for the money, after calibration of course...and on a screen that is the right size and gain (92" and under, 1.3 - suitable of light output, accurate image)

Mitsubishi HC4000 - no experience

Any other questions, please ask. Sorry about the delay! Hope this helps!

[Vic]

Okay
okay

Here are links to reviews I have read for some of these projectors.

Epson 3010
http://www.projectorcentral.com/epso...tor_review.htm

HD 33 Optima
http://www.projectorcentral.com/opto...tor_review.htm
http://www.projectorreviews.com/optoma/hd33/index.php

Optoma HD 8300
http://www.projectorcentral.com/opto...tor_review.htm
http://www.projectorreviews.com/optoma/hd8300/index.php

Sony VPL-HW30ES
http://www.projectorcentral.com/sony...tor_review.htm

Panasonic PT AE7000
http://www.projectorcentral.com/pana...tor_review.htm

Mitsubishi HC9000D
http://www.projectorreviews.com/mits...000d/index.php



From what I'm reading the panny seems to be the new big thing on the block at the price point that is reasonable.

I do not think Mike's past comparison of past models to newer models is a valid comparison. Also i have read newer stronger lamps that can not be beat. So 92" screen max? While Epson which is a much less powerful light canon gets greater reviews?

Either all these reviews are garbage or...
I do not know anymore.....

Confused.

[Mike Osadciw]

Hi Vic

Past model comparisons...hmmm...actually, I'm not comparing, I'm just informing based on my experience in the field. I personally owned a 720p PT-AE500 back in 2003. It got loaded with green dots everywhere - I counted 43. It was so horrendous (plus the blue panel was dying) that Panasonic replaced it with the PT-AE700 a year and a half later...maybe 2 years later...can't remember. I only have one minor green spot on this model after running it for four years. I harped on the Panasonic guys about it and was told year after year...the PT-AE900, PT-AE1000, PT-AE2000, PT-AE3000, PT-AE4000...that this "dust in the system" problem would be fixed. I was tired of going to clients' homes, calibrating their PT-AEx000 model only to have them ask me what the green dots were... I hated them being disappointed. Anyways...I just saw it more often than I should have. Because of this, I can't feel "good inside" to recommend anyone to buy the new PT-AE7000 for that reason alone. For picture quality - all Panasonics have been superb for the price - that I will not deny.

In the middle of all all of this I recommended the Panasonic to a personal friend (it was a PT-AE2000) because of the image quality/price. Guess what? Only a few months later it had green dots on the image. Because of this projector it strained my relationship with him and the dealer I recommended him to purchase the unit from. At the time I should have known better to take that risk. Now I pretty much tell everyone it's a great projector for picture quality, BUT...

Panasonic can win back my recommendation if they prove this year that actually corrected the problem...six models later...

I wouldn't be hard on the reviews you posted. Remember that reviewers don't often keep the product for a long time and won't notice these things as the products will probably have little run time on them. I sometimes see things because I often see systems that have been installed and used for a year or more. This is just one product that stands out as a "be careful" item - just be clear with your dealer before puchase, or Panasonic, that you want the issue to be handled well should you have an affected product.

I look forward to reviewing the unit in the future and seeing many perfect units a year from now!

[Suave]

Thank you for sharing all this information with us Mike - while information about past models can't be used to judge new models, it can certainly assist significantly when looking for a new projector.

Based on your experience with the Panasonic projectors (plus a friend that owned one of these), I definitely wouldn't be buying one of these. I own a few year old Epson PowerLite Home Cinema 1080 UB projector and I've been very pleased with it since the start. When it comes time to upgrade, I'll definitely consider an Epson again, although I would like to step it up to one of the new JVC 3D models.

[Mike Osadciw]

Hi Suave

Yes...I'd love to see the Panasonic back on my recommended list! I'm crossing my fingers this year! Other than that one issue, it's a great low-light output projector! (meaning keep it no more than 100", best at 92" and under for the brightest, punchiest picture with good blacks!)

[Vic]

I hear that the Panny use the Epson LCD panels.
So why would the green dots appear in the panny and not the epson?
Dust?
Do they have a dust elimination mechanism as I heard the Old Boxlight's have?
or will a blast of compressed air help?

This is not increasing my confidence with projectors.

Basically what is being said is if the price is too good, then you need to know the history of the device.

Why are the JVC's and Epson so much better with lower lumens and less than half the features?
I can understand cheap optimas being popular by simply being cheap but the panny is made to be "a director's type of projector".

Why are the SIM projectors so good?
Runco? Sony? (Who have lost over 1.3 billion in their Television division)
What do they have that the others do not?
Are we doomed that quality stuff will fade in favor of lower cost alternatives?
(an example is the proliferation of MP3 music format which is heavily compressed and garbage, when other formats existed that were better but discontinued due to financial restrictions and adoption failure. To get that high quality now, you have to pay through the nose with high end equipment that tries as best as possible to raise the quality of sound.)

Basically what is being said is that if you want value in the sense of reliability and workmanship you have to pay for it. Meaning just get a large screen TV which will give you less hassle and last longer.
Go for the 70-75 inch screens and you almost get a projector with less hassles.

A 70-75 inch Sharp costs less than a decent projector and is less hassle. (i.e. spots, lamps, screen type, mounting, etc).
With people living in phone booth like homes now or condos, why bother with a projector?

Maybe I am just venting here, but it sounds more and more like...never mind......

Disgruntled at hearing truths......

[Mike Osadciw]

A 70-inch TV may be better for some people rather than a projector...depending on their room environment.

I've always said that a good projector done right can certainly offer a superior experience. Good doesn't always need to be expensive, but often it is. Although, there are hidden gems in the entry level playing field.

The more expensive the projector, the more light it makes (generally, but not always). Some specialty features can make a projector costly. The technology can have a premium as well.

For a variety of reasons:

-LCDs are the cheapest
-then Single chip DLP
-then LCoS/D-ILA/SXRD
-then 3 Chip DLP (always the premium)

What makes one technology better over another? Well...very simplified: 3-chip DLP will give you the brightest and most accurate grayscale and colour (with appropriate controls). It has a reasonable fill factor (gap between pixels). High intra-frame contrast ratio. Often used in Digital Cinema, this is your chance to have it in the home. Drawbacks? Black level not very deep.

JVC/Sony technologies: high fill factor (pixels very close together) extremely good grayscale and colour control. Excellent black levels. Drawbacks? Low intra-frame contrast ratio (contrast within a scene).

Single Chip DLP: good on many levels with appropriate controls, light output depends on lamp used. Drawbacks? Dithering, colour wheel artefacts (rainbows). Colour wheel can fail after years of use.

3-chip LCD: lower light projectors. Good grayscale and colour, most have appropriate image controls that work. Drawbacks: lowest fill factor (big spaces between pixels), weak black level, low inter- and intra-frame contrast ratios. Panels can noticably wear over time.

The more expensive models tend to have advanced video processing, bigger light engines, and superior lenses. You need to determine what system is good for your application and move forward with it. I didn't mean to be hard on the Panasonic, because as we know no manufacturer will be free from problems down the road, and on the flipside any of these manufacturers could have a perfect trouble-free life in your home theater!